Thursday, April 10, 2008

Thought of the Day

Sweden has taken in 40,000 Iraqi refugees while America has only taken in 6,000 (which were mostly people who worked as translators and fixers for the U.S.).


Anonymous said...

Ah...Sweden, still trying to make up for neutrality to Hitler? How about this, we'll call it even, or we'll allow you criticize us on this when you meet the simple formula.

# of Americans killed by the Third Reich +
# of refugees American has taken in since WW2
=# of refugees by Sweden since WW2.

Also, is it nice to know that USA is #1 for total refugees accepted in 2006 & 2007.

(France was #1 in 2004 & 2005.)

Now, Newscat does raise a point.
Should the USA accept more refugees? I'll say, "yes."
How many?
I'll say a 4% increase over the previous year.

Anonymous said...

I'm with :-jon. Mark Steyn's point that Europe's immigration policy plus their declining birthrate will cede Europe to Islam is a point to be considered. I believe Iraqis should be treated as all other countries when it comes to the US immigration policy--and an added point is that we do not want the best and brightest of Iraq to be pouring into Sweeden, or any other country, for that matter. We want them to stay in Iraq to help build that country.

Jim in Cleveland

NewsCat said...

I think phrasing like "ceding Europe to Islam" is kind of alarmist. I mean, a) ultimately its just a religion, which is only spread by its own popularity. and b) so what? I mean, why is it "bad" if Europe became more muslim? As opposed to say a resurgance in Catholicism?

Secondly Iraqis aren't like a native species of animal we have to protect. They are free human beings who have just as much right to seek safety and freedom. Look if you were a doctor living in a war-torn country and you were literally afraid, not only for yourself but for your wife and children, wouldn't YOU want to say "hey I love my country but I don't want to die here and I don't want my kids to die here...I'm going to leave where its save and I can live in peace."

While we understand the need for the---what do you want to call them--intellectuals?---to want stay, if I was one of them I totally would leave to. The U.S. doesn't get to say "sorry Doctor Iraqi...we know it's dangerous but if you leave your country...well someday...when the violence dies down....well it might be difficult to put your country back together. If you live long enough to see that we mean."

I don't know how to make things safer in Iraq, but I do know that I'm not going to believe in not allowing people to immigrate just because it's some theoretical idea that we need the Iraqis in Iraq. People should have the right to seek saftey.

Anonymous said...

First, JUST a religion? I, for one, as a Christian, think the beatitudes hold a little more promise for society than Mohammed's teachings. As a feminist, you shouldn't be so glib about the differences between Christianity and Islam when it comes to views on women. Westerners can complain about the lack of women priests--those in Arab countries are taught that Mohemmed said "women are deficient in intelligence and religion." I dare you to find a quote from Jesus like that.

Listen, Rachel, if you think a Muslim culture is no different than a Christian one (to quote you, "So what?"), you have some reading to do. Much is made about how the big bad Catholic Church won't get into The Now and allow gay marriage. Over in Muslimville, they pop you in the head with a stone, till yer dead. Here, we are free to protest a war, or a tax, or injustice, and we are protected by the law. Over in the Arab street, publish the wrong cartoon, and you have rioting and vast numbers of dead.

Islam isn't spreading just out of popularity, either. Those people rioting in the streets of France were not converts. By the way, they don't take to kindly to converting TO Christianity. Once a country goes Muslim, it ain't coming back--tell Lebanon or the Christians in Islamic countries "so what" if their country has Sharia law.

I know it sounds all cozy and comfy and tolerant to say all religions are the same. And I think Muslims in our country should have every protection, and I know Muslims themselves can be great people, or assholes, just like everybody else. But we Westerners make a grave error if we simply equate Christianity with Islam, and if we are so willing to accept Muslim culture as the equivilent of our own.

Jim in Cleveland

NewsCat said...

Jim I know let's ask? "Islam, Juadism, or Christianity...which is the one true faith!"

And then we can have a cursade. Oh wait that's a terrible idea.

I think Steyn is playing to base fears everyone has about "the people not like them." It's an old game. Don't fall for it.

Anonymous said...

I didn't know this was 1095, or the days of the Inquisition.

Rachel, saying there is one true faith IS NOT the same as calling for a crusade. All I am saying is don't succumb to the relativism.

You believe in abortion rights. I believe in the opposite. I wouldn't expect you to feel our views were essentially equivilant. Yet we can co-exist, and even be friends, in this country. That doesn't mean I accept your view as being "as true" as mine, or vice versa. Why should the fact I believe in Christ, a Jew believes in Jehovah, and a Muslim believes in Allah and The Prophet be considered unimportant--"just religion," as you said?

Even modern Islam is not about peacefully co-existing. The rioters in France, the cartoon rioters, the countries that call for the destruction of Israel--those are not hypotheticals. Christians crusaded against the Moslems for various reasons, some even justifiable (the media portrays it as all the fault of Christianity, as if the Muslims were innocent lambs). But that is not what we do today.

I am not calling on Christians to crusade against Islam. I am saying Christians should defend Christianity. If one's belief in God, and in the freedom to believe in a loving God rather than an Allah that calls for death to the Infidel, is not worth defending, then I don't know what is. Again, I just don't want to see Europe become a bunch of Lebanons, where once the Christians are outnumbered, they are treated as second-class citizens.

Jim in Cleveland

NewsCat said...

Jim this has been developing into a fascinating discussion but one which I hope others will decide to continue in my steed.

Suffice to say let me end on something I know we agree with. Season 2 of Jericho did disappoint.

Anonymous said...

Fair enough. I think it is an important topic--but I hope people try not to marginalize those with my point of view with accusations of xenophobia.

Jericho was never a great show, but I did think they wrapped it up well enough, considering they had to. But I just didn't buy the whole Halliburton story line.

Jim in Cleveland